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Episode 33: [GUEST] Facing the Shadow as You Write and Share Your Work with Catherine DeMonte

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Facing the Shadow as You Write and Share Your Work

In this week’s episode, number 33, of the Inspired Writer Collective Podcast, Elizabeth speaks with psychotherapist, Catherine DeMonte, about the presence of the shadow and how it can emerge in your life and through your writing. What is “the shadow”? Every one of us has shadows in our life. They’re the blocks that appear that prevent you from showing up fully in your life. They may come from past trauma, family narratives, or struggles you’ve faced. How can writer’s show up authentically? When shadows present themselves, they often appear through memories, and when you have a repetitive memory it’s important to stop and pay attention. Ask yourself: what is the theme of my memories? It’s the same idea of bringing your shadow into the light in order to move forward and show up for yourself. It becomes more about your reader and less about you as the writer. Listen to the podcast to hear more about what Catherine DeMonte learned from writing her book and the benefits of writing memoir. Catherine DeMonte’s Abundance Circles: Catherine is offering one of her Abundance Circles groups starting Thursday, July 18th at 6:30pm PST. You’ll meet 8 times, discuss the 7 tools for powerful creation & living your unstoppable life, and devote two nights of discussion to shadow work. The group size is limited, but there are still a few spots left. Check it out here: https://www.catherinedemonte.com/8-sessiongroup 
SPOTLIGHT on Catherine Demonte: Catherine DeMonte has been a licensed psychotherapist in Southern California for more than 25 years. She is also the author of a multi-award winning book: Beep! Beep! Get Out of My Way! Seven Tools for Powerful Creation & Living Your Unstoppable Life. She is the creator of 8-session online Abundance Circle groups for women. The 7 modern and ancient Law of Attraction tools in these groups help people finally call in what they have been desiring to have for a very long time. Their romantic partner to share life with. Financial freedom and flow. New jobs or moves to a specific city. These are some of the things participants have called in from the Circles and the book based on the powerful tools from them. The tools generate the inner and outer shifts that create lasting shifts.
How can you connect with Catherine DeMonte?

Website: www.catherinedemonte.com​
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/​
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/catherinedemonte/?hl=en​

We invite you to subscribe to our email list to be the first to know about our weekly podcast episodes and upcoming group programs for writers!

If you prefer video versions of the podcast or want to leave a comment on this specific episode, you can find all of them on our YouTube channel.

Welcome fellow writers to the Inspired Writer Collective podcast, your go to hub for all things writing. We're your hosts, Elizabeth and Stephanie. Whether you're a seasoned wordsmith or just dipping your quill into the ink well of creativity, we're absolutely thrilled to have you with us. Drawing from our experience in publishing diverse writing genres and the daily grind of showing up for yourself, we're here to be your writing companions. Expect insightful discussions, expert tips, and a dash of inspiration as we navigate the twists and turns of the writing journey together. So whether you're listening on your commute, during your writing session, or just relaxing at home, get ready for an immersive experience that celebrates the art and joy of writing. Hi,

Elizabeth:

Good morning, listeners. You're in for a treat. I am here with Catherine Damonte. She is a licensed psychotherapist in Southern California, and she is the author of a multi award winning book called, Beep Beep, Get Out of My Way, Seven Tools for Powerful Creation and Living Your Unstoppable Life. And I just have to tell you, I had a previous meeting with Catherine, and we had so much fun. I guess the word is fun. It was fun, but it was definitely a very engaging and deep conversation about the writing process about the shadow work that can come up in regards to writing people pleasing, um, as well as just finding that way to be vulnerable and authentic in your writing. So we're going to talk about a number of those topics today in this episode. And we'll include links in the show notes to all of Catherine's stuff, including her coaching options and her website and Instagram. Um, so if you enjoy anything that you hear from us today, please subscribe to the podcast, like it, join, look into Catherine's stuff. We're so excited to have you here, Catherine. Um, would you mind just giving a little bit of background about how you got into this work?

Catherine:

Oh sure, absolutely. I would love to and thank you for having me Elizabeth. It's such a pleasure to see you again and to reach out to your subscribers and listeners. Um, I got into this work because I'm a psychotherapist in private practice and through that work I noticed that there were certain blocks that kept people back from showing up more fully. So I would talk to them about shadow work, for example, or being more mindful or watching their thoughts, and those things seem to really shift things for my clients. But then I started gathering them together. And realize that what I came up with were already being spoken about in the abundance world, you know, or law of attraction world, or on the secret, things like that. Um, and I created an abundance circle, and in that group I shared those, those modern and ancient tools, and people were calling in what they most wanted. Um, things that have been elusive to them for a long time, but that their heart really desired, like a partner, or more financial flow and things like that, and that became, um, the, the, the tools I shared in my book, for example, and that I shared in my Abundance Circle groups. And it includes

Elizabeth:

That's

Catherine:

that over.

Elizabeth:

Um, Stephanie and I just did a like a book review sort of thing or a book club reading of the alchemist

Catherine:

I

Elizabeth:

interesting that you brought up like the secret and all this ancient wisdom and how much of that is still So relevant today and

Catherine:

Absolutely.

Elizabeth:

back in like the mainstream discussion all of a

Catherine:

Mm hmm. Mm

Elizabeth:

I'm not sure exactly what we've done to sort of forget this ancient wisdom to need to like Recall it back in but it does seem like people or society as a whole is more primed to receive this information Now

Catherine:

hmm.

Elizabeth:

you know a decade

Catherine:

Mm hmm. Absolutely. You're so right. It's so fascinating, isn't it? How the collective, it's like individuals, require something at certain times. to move forward and to become more conscious and the timing of this is so, you're so right that it's, it seems so, uh, clear that there must have been a need for it for us to shift as a collective, you know, on the whole. And by the way, I love that episode and I love the alchemist, the book. Yeah.

Elizabeth:

you know, Stephanie and I hadn't read it before and then all of a sudden, you know, just kind of came to it and it hit us that, you know, a really important part of our own writing journeys, business growth, all of that, you know, but I think it's such a good reminder of like, Understanding the struggles, the dark sides of what you're going to go through when you're working towards your, you know, desired outcome. And I certainly find that to be true in memoir writing, where it's like, oh, I want to write this story, I want to, Share my message and in doing so, I'm sort of require myself to dig back through some really, you know, heavy trenches at

Catherine:

Right. Right.

Elizabeth:

is it that your work helps guide people through some of that, that stuff that may come up in like, A creative writing process or poetry or any sort of artistic endeavor.

Catherine:

First of all, I think that writing or putting yourself out there in any way is such a brave act. It's, it's, it's for the noble, isn't it? It's for the, it's not for, for people that are shy about showing up at all. And it's absolutely a truism that our shadow material is going to show up as we're about to step forward into the world and be seen, uh, wounds and shadows, like, uh, who do you think you are, or, um, Or believing we don't have a voice, all the different things we picked up and believe to be true are going to show up when we're, we're going to step out, uh, on a, on a larger, on a larger, uh, stage, for example. So the first thing I think to do is to get clear that that's what's showing up versus believing. the thoughts. By that I mean, if we're feeling things like, um, what if I fail, or who am I to use my voice, or who's going to listen to me, if we believe that and, um, take it on as true, we will not show up. We won't take the steps to, to push past it. We will also lose the opportunity, the tuning, the opportunity to look at what's, where that belief came from and heal it once and for all. Once it's brought up to the light of consciousness, we can choose to tend to it and realize that it never was true.

Elizabeth:

Yeah, absolutely. You know, there's so much, of the reason why I sort of espouse memoir as one of the greatest, uh, personal development and self healing methodologies that I've ventured into is because of the reframing that I've been able to do by exploring those, uh, those past experiences and those old stories. you know, at the time, because of the impact of trauma, you take away a certain narrative or story about what that event was, what it means about you, what it means

Catherine:

Yes.

Elizabeth:

or the world as a whole. And so in revisiting some of that, then I was able to see clearly, like, that it didn't mean this whole bigger, broader story of the world's not safe, or I'm not valued, or I, you know, etc.

Catherine:

Wow.

Elizabeth:

I was able to just then accept it for what the, you know, the distinct incident that it was, and then sort of reframe that story that I tell myself about myself. And I think that's. One of the most profound and beautiful things about any sort of whether it's memoir writing or whether it's just journaling for personal, you know, development and personal use is that ability to change the story you tell yourself about yourself.

Catherine:

Beautiful. I love what you just said. And also congratulations for recognizing that you could push past that. You could look at it as opposed to believing it. And dropping it, you know, dropping a project. I think it's extra vulnerable to write a memoir because there are other players involved. So wounds of, um, I need to protect my parents or my siblings or my, whoever might be involved or that uncle or, you know, whatever it is that brought up the pain in the first place, we may be exposing them. So that could be really scary. So congratulations on, on getting that piece. That's really, really brave of you. Um, and I also love what you said about looking at it so it can be changed. It won't change if we don't bring it up and then look at it and then ask if it's true. Is that really true about me or was that my takeaway? And also making sense that we did take that message away. We may have been told specifically certain things, like for example, don't be so vain, or who do you think you are? We may have literally heard those words, or we don't expose family secrets, don't you dare tell anybody about this. It feels like our life depends on believing the grown ups in our life when we're little. They take care of us. So to um, go into shadow material and ask if it was true and then be there for the little girl or the little boy inside of us who was hurt, um, and love them up and tend to that wound, um, helps us become more whole, helps us become the person

Elizabeth:

what

Catherine:

in it.

Elizabeth:

of

Catherine:

Mm-Hmm. Mm-Hmm.

Elizabeth:

um, like advice or guidance do you give to people want to know how to best support themselves as they move through some of that shadow work? Because, of course, the natural tendency for just a safety mindset is like, oh, don't go there. The brain tells you, oh, that's not safe. We don't want to dig into that. So how do you, you know, overcome that and what sort of protections or resources do you recommend people have in place or utilize?

Catherine:

hmm. For one, there's a chapter on shadow material and how to tend to it in the book. Um, it's right up in the front because it's, it's such a vital and important one. The, um, the short answer would be to pull it out and then look at its positive, um, opposite. So let's say it's vanity that's in our shadow. So we don't feel like we are allowed to be confident. We may even shrink. You know, the way we move through the world is a smaller version of ourselves, or we hide our gifts, or we, um, play small. The opposite of vanity might be amplified confidence, for example. Um, if we, um, have anger in our shadow, like if we were told as little girls that it's not, not nice to be angry, um, we may have pushed down anger and then repressed it every time we felt it. But that would mean that we probably aren't very good at setting boundaries, because that might make somebody feel bad. So, what would be the opposite of anger? Might be, um, that I'm entitled to use my voice. Um, so looking at the opposite of it, of, of what is in our shadow, um, can become our, our best and strongest trait when we pull it out to the light. One way to know what's in your shadow is by paying attention to what triggers you. So, um, if you're really triggered by, if any of us are really triggered by a particular person or a particular trait, um, we might look at where we have that in our shadow. And it will feel justifiable because it will be unattractive traits like, um, people who are mean or people, um, who are bossy, people who are unkind, people who cut us off on the freeway. The reason we know that it's in our shadow is none of us like being cut off on the freeway, for example, right? But not all of us feel the need to,

Elizabeth:

hmm.

Catherine:

drive really quickly and make sure they see us and then get in front of them and go slow so that they can feel what we felt when they did that to us. Not all responding that way. So even if it's something that would bother anybody, if you are triggered, Which is different than being annoyed, but if you, if you get enraged, you know that that's in your shadow. So what does being cut off by others, or people who think they're better than me, if that's what you say about that driver, where, where is that in your shadow? You know, so look, looking at where you get triggered will show you what's in your shadow. Um, and then you want to tend, tend to that by seeing where you might turn it to its opposite. And positive traits.

Elizabeth:

Now, Catherine, how would you define being triggered? Because I feel like that's a word that's been a little bit Manipulated, overused, watered down in today's speak of like, oh that triggered me. Oh, that's triggering You know, it's it's a little bit like thrown around a little bit like narcissism is where everything's labeled narcissism You know, it's kind of like a lot of things get labeled as triggered, but you kind of mentioned it's not just You know, being annoyed by something. How would you define like what really being triggered and an indicator that there's something in your shadow to explore? What does that really, how would that show up?

Catherine:

That is a great question. When you're triggered, you'll feel it in your body. You'll get, you'll feel hot. You'll feel lit up with, with rage and anger or sadness. It's more than just. Um, feeling the emotion or noting it. You will absolutely have a reaction and I like looking at it somatically we feel it in our body. We're not just mad We're lit up we are Or deeply deeply hurt deeply sad when it When it wouldn't bother somebody else to that degree, even if we would all agree that's not a nice thing to happen, when it happens to us, uh, and it's not just, that's annoying or that's frustrating, but it's, we're deeply affected, either by, you know, with sadness or anger or rage or, um, you know, or, or just feeling it in our gut, that's a trigger.

Elizabeth:

Well, and that's a good thing to keep in mind too, because not only do we, is it important to recognize our own triggers? But also to notice when someone else is reacting in such a way because they were triggered and therefore that's their

Catherine:

Mm.

Elizabeth:

to

Catherine:

Mm.

Elizabeth:

like what you as the doer may need to like Apologize for or make concessions for you know, and you can

Catherine:

Mm.

Elizabeth:

really has an overreaction to something Recognizing that yeah, maybe it warrants an apology, but then like

Catherine:

Yeah.

Elizabeth:

did your part, now it's up to them to do their shadow work.

Catherine:

I love that because when I heard you say that what I, what came up for me was that that creates empathy for that person. So empathy, I mean, sorry, um, impact and, um, intention are different things, aren't they? So let's say we didn't mean for it to land the way it did. And we noticed that somebody is really, really hurt or triggered. We can, we can recognize that the impact on them has to do with their wounds. So even if we didn't intend to hurt their feelings. We can't apologize for it, like you said, and to even explore where it landed for them. Like I noticed that really hurt when I said that. I'm really sorry. What happened? Where did you go with that? Especially with our partners, our children, you know, like if we are correcting them or our children, or we say something to our partner and it lands really poorly and it shocks us how it landed. We can judge them for being too sensitive or taking everything wrong, you know, using expressions like that When it actually landed on top of their wound and it's really good for us to recognize that but it's also very healing for the other because they can say it brought up my feeling of my voice not mattering or You know, whatever it is that it brings up That gives them an opportunity to look this way, at what came up, and that's how we can heal our wounds as well. Because every time we get to express what showed up, we're actually tending to our shadow.

Elizabeth:

And two, it makes me think that in a sense we're kind of preventing or mitigating some of those people pleasing tendencies. When we can recognize that that person has been triggered because I know for me, I, growing up, I was a serial people pleaser. I mean, even through like my career and everything, you know, worried about not wanting to get those kind of large reactions. Those felt very scary to me.

Catherine:

Mm hmm.

Elizabeth:

and so I had a tendency more to just people please,

Catherine:

Yeah.

Elizabeth:

you know, of course my own detriment.

Catherine:

Yeah. Mm hmm. Mm hmm.

Elizabeth:

worried about triggering somebody else, especially if it was like someone I knew well, so I knew that that was, you know, a particular style of communication or subject matter that was triggering or whatnot. And so it just kind of eggshell around it.

Catherine:

That also keeps us out of the present, doesn't it, a bit? Not being really present. present in that moment because we're sort of playing three dimensional chess. If I were to say that, then they might go here and I don't want that to happen, so therefore I will. It's exhausting. We're not as authentic and again, we're not as present because we're wondering what they're going to say and what I should say instead so that they don't go there versus letting them have whatever their reaction is because we've just said something authentic and true and if they go someplace, We get to back ourselves up by saying, I'm, you know, everything we just said, like, I'm really sorry it landed that way, or, uh, if we were upset, yeah, I am, I am upset, and then kind of owning it and allowing ourselves, instead of people pleasing to have those feelings, like, yeah, I am upset, you're right, and it goes wanted. Mm

Elizabeth:

So how do we as writers maintain our authenticity in our writing? How do we, how can we best like step forward with that, you know, vulnerable story and, and still, you know, feel authentic? Because there's so many, there's so many emotional barriers to

Catherine:

hmm. I think when we're writing books. And our material starts coming up and it will, it can sometimes show up as, um, memories popping up. And I noticed that when I was writing memories of a couple of unkind people in my life were showing up. And I was wondering why I was thinking about them so much. It would act, it would actually show up as I was writing. I'd have a memory and I think I thought it was unrelated. I thought it was that I wasn't focused. Then I realized all those. Those people that weren't very nice when I was pretty young, you know, when I was playing with them, they were giving me the message that my voice didn't matter. Like they didn't want to play with me because I was younger than they were. And therefore I had no value. I had nothing to say, nothing to contribute. Oh, no wonder. This is showing up as I'm trying to share with an audience that I don't know yet. I don't know who'll be reading it, but what if they, right. I think I have nothing of value to add. That would be awful. It was so unconscious, though. It was only because of the repetition of those memories coming up that I had to stop and pay attention. So one way as writers to note what's coming up is to pay attention to patterns showing up. Another thing that happened, and it may happen for for writers that are listening is suddenly I was Really focused on organizing the house, even though my house is pretty organized. Anyway, I, it became very important suddenly to, um, organize the towels in the linen closet, for example, they're not going to jump into the right color, uh, piles by themselves after all. So I better go do that right now. It was ridiculous how, how I suddenly was so distracted. To do other things when I was, when I had set aside time for writing. So paying attention to being distracted and not sitting down in your chair and writing is, is one thing to pay attention to. And the other is what memories are showing up as you try to, you know, try to do your work. What is the theme beneath the memories that are popping up? And then how can you tend to that theme? One way might be to say things like, I've got you, you know, this, or this message is important. Your audience needs to hear this is another really important place to land. It's no longer about us, the writer, but who needs to hear these words.

Elizabeth:

Yeah, you've hit on a number of things in this conversation that I've listed out as like the five major blocks that people have in writing their memoir. You know, you've talked earlier on in the episode about, you know, what other people are going to think, especially those people who be supporting characters in your story, um, or even the audience as a whole. Um, how you're going to be judged, potentially, will there be retribution or any sort of backlash for the things that you share, whether that's from the people who they're, you know, pertained to, or whether that's just society as a whole, like, oh, you're a horrible mother that you did that, or how you're so stupid, how could you have done that, you

Catherine:

Mm-Hmm.

Elizabeth:

And then also that piece you just landed on about, like, do I have anything worth saying? Is this going to be valuable? How is this any different than what everyone else has already

Catherine:

Mm-Hmm.

Elizabeth:

and it can be difficult to break through those roadblocks, but For me, when I read a memoir, what I'm looking for is not necessarily the most beautifully written prose and narrative,

Catherine:

Mm-Hmm.

Elizabeth:

I do really want just the heart of the story, the vulnerability of the emotions, you know, the Authentic thoughts and responses, even if then the person later is like, yeah, I realized in the moment that that wasn't a great response, but that's what my response was because this is how I was feeling and this is what I knew at the time. And you know, it wasn't that great on my part, but you know, this is how I learned from it. And here's how you can go about your life and not make the same,

Catherine:

Yeah. Yes.

Elizabeth:

and pitfalls.

Catherine:

Yes. Absolutely. I don't think anybody reading a memoir is looking for perfection. And that would be boring to read anyway, wouldn't it, that, you know, I, I sailed through life and it was beautiful and that's the end, would be very, very boring. It's reading about people struggling and yet got to this place, even if that struggle was a different one from, from ours. And there's such grace in it.

Elizabeth:

Go

Catherine:

Oh, that's okay. Thank you. Wow.

Elizabeth:

were trying to find what their like core message might be. One of the journaling prompts was, what are the things that you don't think you should say? You know, like, what are those things that, like, back, you know, in secret because whether it's the like family doesn't, you know, air our dirty laundry or for whatever reason like I hated my kids when they were, you know, newborns and it took a long time because I was in this postpartum, you know, anxiety or postpartum depression. What are the things that like that you felt that you sensed were? You were not able to say because it's those sort of things. I'll read on the page. like that maybe it's in their shadow side, but there's that part of like, Oh, they actually said that thing that I was thinking. And I judged myself for thinking here's someone

Catherine:

Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Mm hmm.

Elizabeth:

or awkward or, you know, judgmental thing and really just own their truth. You know, there's so much, I think so much beauty in the vulnerability of being willing to say those things that society as a whole tells us. shouldn't say, or we shouldn't feel, or we shouldn't even think in the first place. Because we all judge ourselves so harshly for those things. But,

Catherine:

Mm hmm.

Elizabeth:

of universality.

Catherine:

There's such permission giving, isn't there, for the reader to know that they can, quote, fail as well, or not, not love their kids when they're newborns, or, you know, the, the other examples that you gave. Like, it's, it's, it's It's so reassuring to know we're not alone in our, in our really big feelings. It's, it's um, it provides grace for people to know that other people struggle as well. And let's say somebody did judge us or judge our writing. It didn't resonate for them or they thought, how dare you say that? Maybe they're not our people. And that's a phrase we can say to ourselves, too, when we're writers. Like, if we, if we find we're thinking about a wide breadth of people not liking this book, maybe that, maybe, the same to ourselves, maybe they're not my people then. There are lots of other books out there for them. But this is for my audience. It will find the right people. And it will serve them well.

Elizabeth:

I was just finishing up, um, Big Magic by Elizabeth Gilbert. And she talks about that reaction to Eat, Pray, Love. Which is one of her, like, favorite songs. Biggest selling books that she wrote.

Catherine:

Mm hmm.

Elizabeth:

And she said that there were plenty of people that just trashed it and

Catherine:

Mm. Mm.

Elizabeth:

blah. I've read this story before. But at the same time, she was also getting emails from people that were like this book changed my life. Right? So you're going to have certain readers that hopefully, you know, that really resonate with your story and that's who it's truly for.

Catherine:

Right.

Elizabeth:

as it is, as it is for some of the negative, um, feedback and how that in our brains takes on so much more weight because of that need to be accepted and a sense of belonging that comes from our primitive minds.

Catherine:

Mm. Mm.

Elizabeth:

living in, you know, tribal communities. you know, it's just like there are going to be people who it touches very deeply and that's who your, your book is for. Like

Catherine:

Right,

Elizabeth:

you're

Catherine:

right. Oh, I love that. And maybe those people who are so outspoken about not liking it, first of all, may have shadow stuff that they need to be looking at, but they feel the need to let somebody know they didn't like it because most of us, if we don't care for something, we'll put it down and move on. So that,

Elizabeth:

Right?

Catherine:

you know, so do we want those people as our, You know, readers anyway, or, or, or is that was my book, not something that they would have ever liked because if they're that strong, if they're reacting that strongly, it may never have gotten through no matter how I wrote it. Maybe it's not on me that they didn't see that, you know, and, and also where we were focused. You're so right that if we're focused there, that probably says something about what's in our shadow. I don't want people to like me or that, um, I want to please everybody. I don't want to, God forbid, ever make anybody upset. So maybe that is just good material for us. And what if we focused on all the people Who move, move forward toward us and say, your books helped me so much. I called in what I've been longing for for years, or in her case, you gave me permission to stop the life. I, you know, get off the path I was on Elizabeth and, you know, go to India or, or marry that partner or, you know, yeah. What if we focused on that?

Elizabeth:

just imagining like getting that kind of response like from a reader of my memoir just already like makes me want to like well up with tears like

Catherine:

Oh,

Elizabeth:

right here, you know,

Catherine:

wow. Yes, that's right.

Elizabeth:

that's why you struggle. Look at me. why you struggle going through the hard

Catherine:

Yeah,

Elizabeth:

that's the Oh,

Catherine:

yes,

Elizabeth:

end goal.

Catherine:

yes, and by the way,

Elizabeth:

in my book.

Catherine:

I so see that for you, I so see that happening, that people resonate and it heals and opens their eyes and moves them forward, because you wrote those words and they read them. Mm, mm.

Elizabeth:

a final question, Catherine, what do you feel was like the biggest you got from your writing? Like as a, as a, you know, individual.

Catherine:

Great question. The greatest takeaway I got was having to do what I had hoped, which is what you and I were just speaking about, and that is. That it moved people forward in, in my particular book was about receiving the one big thing that had been missing for them in their life at that, at the time that they've got the book, um, or are, are in the My Abundance circles, which also go over the tools, which is I finally have a partner who is all that I ever wanted in a partner. I finally made that move to that city that I wanted to when I was so stuck where I was and didn't see a way to get there or, um, my money is finally flowing. Abundance is finally coming in. That feels so good. I can do more in my life because of that. I have financial freedom and, and I'm so grateful that I'm here, you know, in this place now, in this place in my life, that that's the, the biggest reward I, I, I get when I. Um, think about what came out of the book and writing it and getting it out.

Elizabeth:

That makes me so excited and so motivated to like, really get back to the work of like finishing my book because I'm so eager for, for that kind of outcome. You know, the writing process can take a really long time.

Catherine:

Yeah.

Elizabeth:

just listening to a podcast episode, I think it was, Um, Modern Wisdom, Chris Williamson, and he had Tim Ferriss on there, and this

Catherine:

Mm.

Elizabeth:

of months ago, but, I was just listening to it this weekend on a hike, and Tim Ferriss was talking about something like 19 rough drafts and 4 total rewrites of one of his

Catherine:

Wow.

Elizabeth:

his, like, First book, like the four hour work week, like one of his later books.

Catherine:

Wow.

Elizabeth:

I was just like, such a relief in that

Catherine:

Yes. Yes.

Elizabeth:

not that far off base. Like I'm still

Catherine:

Oh, I love that for you. That makes me happy that you heard that. And what good timing to hear it for you at this point. Oh,

Elizabeth:

right.

Catherine:

yes. Yeah. Yeah. Oh,

Elizabeth:

Catherine.

Catherine:

I'm reassuring.

Elizabeth:

joy to have another conversation

Catherine:

much, Elizabeth. Thank you. so

Elizabeth:

I know your warm spirit is going to come through, you know, in this interview and for the listeners to be able to absorb. And again, we'll put all the links so people can connect with you. Um, and just dig into more of the work that you offer and the guidance and assistance. And just. Thank you so much. I so much out of our conversations and

Catherine:

thank

Elizabeth:

to be able to share this conversation with others and let them be flies on the wall for this because,

Catherine:

you.

Elizabeth:

um, yeah, it's so life giving for me and I imagine it'll be life giving for others as well.

Catherine:

Oh, thank you so much. I would love that to happen. I would love it to be life giving. A beautiful way to put it. Thank you. Thank you for having me. It was a pleasure to be here.

Elizabeth:

Um, all right, listeners, like, subscribe, comment, share with a friend. Maybe you know someone that needs to hear this message as well. Um, again, thank you, Catherine, for being here and we'll be back next week. Bye, guys.

Catherine:

Bye.

Stephanie:

Thank you so much for tuning in to another episode of the Inspired Writer Collective podcast. We hope you found inspiration, insights, and connection to yourself as a writer. If you enjoyed this episode, please share, subscribe, and leave us a five star review. Remember, the power of storytelling lies within each of us, and by supporting one another, we can make a difference. We invite you to schedule a coffee chat with us on our website, www. inspiredwritercollective. com. Just like our style here on the podcast, our coffee chats are casual and a way to connect about your writing. You can also become a part of our community by connecting with us on social media. You can find us on Instagram and YouTube at Inspired Writer Collective. Let's continue this writing journey together. You can find links in the show notes. Until next time, fellow writers, may your pens be mighty and your stories captivating. Happy writing!

People on this episode

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Elizabeth Wilson

Host
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Stephanie Oswald, Ph.D.

Host